LA -
you're making me whore myself out. Thanks.

I present to you, gay-light.

and what the hell is wrong with being thought of a gay, anyway? jesus christ. gay men happen to dress better, look better, have better taste, better hair and in most cases, make more money. why the fuck would any guy claim to be anything less?? duh.

I wrote this just for you, Jodi.

After I wake up a bit more, I'm going to post an article just for you, Jodi.

I'm sorry, but straight men size each other up all the time. Did we all forget the star athletes in high school were the only ones who never had a problem getting some? Did we all forget that guys with the v-shape, and the girls with the best boobs got all the attention growing up? We all size each other up physically because we're genetically predisposed to doing so. Get over it men, you get jealous of a square jaw, broad shoulders, and tight abs, the same way your woman looks at a model figure and says "I hate that bitch." Geesh, you're not gay, just jealous.

Rev, I abhor that phrase too. (In fact, I can't stand any "Seinfeld" references, even though I do like the show.)

This whole thread brings something up in my mind...

If I hear that goddamned patronizing phrase "not that there's anything wrong with it" ONE more time I'm going to ralph in rainbow shades.

There ISN'T. If you're going to make a comment that might make you sound homophobic if you don't excuse yourself in that way, DON'T MAKE IT.

/rant

All I know is, if the question is reversed, and I ask my wife if she thinks our waitress is good-looking, I may find some ice water in my lap.

"straight guys really CAN'T tell if another guy is good looking". Ah ah, wrong !
For straight guys "good-looking" or "attractive" means, most of the times, "possible sex partner", and not "I wish I'd be like him". It's disturbing when it comes to men.
Actually, Jodi, you could take it as a compliment from your date. His fantasies are focused and cant't be distracted...

It's not ego, and we're not lying: straight guys really CAN'T tell if another guy is good looking. Why is that so hard to accept? We can vaguely sense when a guy *should* be considered good looking... if he's muscular, has chiseled features, a square face, or possesses in abundance any of the other typically masculine features. But we don't tend to think of those men as "attractive," we think of them as "cool." (ACCEPTABLE: Harrison Ford is cool. NOT: Harrison Ford is good-looking.) More often than not, we have no clue what makes a man attractive to women. Most of them pointed out to us by you leave us scratching our heads. Someday, someone will have to explain to me fully the mysteries known as Warren Beatty, or Leonardo DiCaprio, or any of a number of others. Until then, bear with us if we don't notice the damn waiter. We only notice him when he keeps us waiting.

While we're on it, we have no clue what nice jewelry looks like. Please drop many hints.

Seems like I'm in the minority here. I have one straight male friend who would like to give Johnny Depp a hug, and most of the others have never taken offense when I've done a hottie-boy alert. Sometimes they even weigh in with their own opinions. It's nice hanging out with people who aren't threatened by sexuality, either their own, or others, and who actually can appreciate beauty wherever it turns up.

In my opinion, a guy can comment on another guy's appearance as long as somewhere during that comment he says: "I'm not gay and I'm not going that way, but..."

The saying has to be said exactly like that, with no deviations on the phrase. That's really the only way said phrase can free a male from all homosexual undertones.

Typically, the comment on another male should also involve some sort of egoboost as well. Example:
"I'm not gay and I'm not going that way, but our waiter could be a movie star. Of course, he's nothing compared to me, but there aren't many males on this planet that are."

[nod]

Loud applause! Damn them that can not admit that another male is good looking! I do ask hub, and he'd not loudly say so but he has let me, the closest female to him know a time or two when he has concurred on another males goodlooks... he knows it does not mean he wants the dude, but due to society he won't go making the same acknowledgements to other people.

Their fragile egos don't allow them to acknowledge that another man might be more attractive or appealing than they are. They aren't wired that way. Of course, they turn it into "I'm not a homo" because they lack the ability to truthfully identify their feelings.

If a man wants to be called "mommy's little hoo-a" does that make him gay?

I never understood it either. I can see a woman when Im with my guy and say "boy she is hot" and he will agree...then I say something about a guy, and he will say he didnt notice. I think it might be the fact that their girls are checking other guys out..and we admit it. Now, if he says "boy that chick is really hot" I might not agree...it goes both ways:)

Just because a male notices the beauty of another human form, be it male or female SHOULD not have any other meaning than just that. He recognizes the beauty, no matter what gender the human form may be.

I don't know, Thomas. I just pulled "Marco the Magnificent Magician" out of my ass hat. I never heard of "Marco the Magnificent".

Aaron is HOT!

Oh my God; I just read about Marco the Magnificent Magician... Marco the Magnificent from the musical "Carnival"? The charismatic and FLAMBOYANT character originally conceived by the mind of Michael Stewart, his book based on material by Helen Deutsch?

That's a Tordant Monkey of a reference.

Damn Jodi, now I'm confused!

I've always had an 'eye for the guys' in terms of being able to spot a good-looker. Well, OK, a pretty boy.

So now, if I'm comfortable with that (which I am), does that mean I have gay tendencies, or does the every fact that I'm comfortable with it mean I can't possibly be?

Of course the same guys that you're aiming this post at, would hear my English accent, and (crossing their closeted fingers in hope) immediately conclude that I must be gay, just because of my ethnicity! Which, given the UK's 60 million population isn't statistically guaranteed!

Still, look on the bright side Jodi. At least you're not here in Denver, where these 'macho' men think nothing of wearing cowboy hats. Hmmm, can you say Village People?

that's a double standard that's existed forever. it's ok for women to say that other women are attractive, but it's not ok for men to say that other men are attractive. enough people believe that that it makes guys uncomfortable to say it. until everyone starts thinking like you do and knowing that a guy saying a guy is attractive doesn't make him a homo, guys will continue to use the "I didn't notice." line. we be livin' in a fucked up world, unfortunately.

whoa...

(welcome back!)

Jodi, maybe your date is merely not noticing the waiter's face because he's been hungrily eyeing the "somnulent snake" coiled in said waiter's tight chinos. Also, if said date was uncomfortable with his inexplicable urge to smoke more sausage than Eckridge, that would explain the very defensive reaction you illicited. Instead of being pissed off, you should smile knowingly and pat his hand.

It's important to not go off half cocked, though. If you haven't known this person very schlong, then you could wouldn't know if he's stiff about his resolve. It would hardly be right to judge him from Peter Long, John Thomas or Hairy Balzach. To dismiss him as being a prick would make you as low as a one eyed snake. I know you're not prone to follow down that slope, but you want to be careful not to blow it.

Jodi has hit the snake on its head. In fact, go into any gym in this country.....step inside the men's locker room. EVERY man in there is sizing each other up: pecs, ass, body hair, quads, and most importantly, the package. Men like to know what the competition has, gay or straight. This is an instinctive thing that every male of every species does: size the other guy up cause he's competition. No matter what the guy says about the waiter, he's thinking to himself: "Damn, I need to hit the gym," or something like, "That guy's package is bigger than mine."

Ah - but you seem to have missed the subtle clues, Jodi.

"I'm not a FUCKING Homo" is essentially admitting to homosexuality, just not that of the fucking variety. Your dates aren't trying to show off their manhood by pretending not to notice, they're simply letting you know that they'd rather you DIDN'T go home with them, as they are not interested in you. They are interested in fooling around with other guys, without going "all the way." As to why they agreed to go on a date with you in the first place...uhm....maybe they liked the waiter too, and couldn't think of a reasonable excuse to go there alone. Maybe they're hoping that you'll get up and storm out in disgust, and when the waiter comes back, he'll ask your former date "what happened?" and then your former date and the waiter will talk at great lengths of the problems with male-female relationships stemming from the ways in which the different sexes tend to view life's little situations, and communicate with each other. After a long talk, the waiter will suggest that your former date and he "go out for a beer and catch a game" at a local sports bar, after which...WHO KNOWS?

Uhm....Not that I know firsthand or anything...after all, I'm not a fuckin' homo, or a homo of any other variety for that matter. (the jury's still out on "sapien")

But I do know miscommunication when I see it.